Oral History Interview with Niki K. Neal

[Interview Begins]

BOWERS HEALEY: All right. Today is November 2nd, 2022. And this is an interview with Niki Neal, who served in the United States Army. This interview is being conducted by Ellen Bowers Healey and I'm conducting it in Oak Creek, Wisconsin, for the Wisconsin Veterans Museum Oral History Program. No one else is present. Niki, can you tell me your full name, please?

NEAL: Niki Kim Neal. Maiden name Jahns.

BOWERS HEALEY: And spell your maiden name, please.

NEAL: J-A-H-N-S.

BOWERS HEALEY: And your first name, please spell that.

NEAL: Niki. N-I-K-I-.

BOWERS HEALEY: And your last name?

NEAL: Neal. N-E-A-L.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay, great. What are the dates of your service, Niki?

NEAL: February 17th, 1992, to February 16th, 2014. Not positive on those.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And you have Reserve time, is that correct?

NEAL: All Reserve.

BOWERS HEALEY: All Reserve time. But you did serve on active duty some of the time?

NEAL: Well, for boot camp, AIT, a couple of MEDRETEs down in South America. And then I was also mobilized for Operation Enduring Freedom.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And what does AIT stand for?

NEAL: Advanced individual training, where we learn our military occupation, our MOS.

BOWERS HEALEY: All right. And MEDRETE, what does that stand for?

NEAL: So, that is a medical ready mission. It's usually in a third world type of country. And the military goes down there to provide medical attention to the native people there.

BOWERS HEALEY: All right. And before we get more into your military service, where were you born and raised?

NEAL: I was born in Oak Creek, Wisconsin, and raised in Oak Creek.

BOWERS HEALEY: And where is Oak Creek, Wisconsin, located? Generally, within the state.

NEAL: South side of Milwaukee. The city of Milwaukee.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And as you were growing up, what did your family consist of?

NEAL: I am the only child. I have my mother and my father married in 1974 and are still married now. So, that would be 40-- they're about to celebrate their 48th wedding anniversary. And that's it. Just me.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And where did you go to school?

NEAL: I went to Carrollton Elementary in Oak Creek. I went to the middle school in Oak Creek, and then I went to Oak Creek High School and graduated there.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. When did you graduate?

NEAL: In 1993.

BOWERS HEALEY: How did you hear about the military?

NEAL: I was a junior in 1992 and the ASVAB test was being offered. I had plans on going to college, so I wanted to take the ASVAB just as another test score to have on my application for college. I took the test, and I scored the highest in 00:03:00my class.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And then from there, how did you connect with the military?

NEAL: So, then every branch, Marines, Navy, every branch called some recruiter of some sort wanting to interview, sit down and talk with me. And I kind of prescreened all of them on the phone because my hair at the time was very, very long. And I said, "Well, will I have to cut my hair?" You know, I was seventeen. So, of course, that's what I was-- or I was sixteen, actually. Of course, that's what I was thinking. So, the Army was the only one that said I would not have to cut my hair to go through basic training.

BOWERS HEALEY: That's interesting that that's the qualifier.

NEAL: They were the only ones that I let come to the house and talked to me about joining.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And so, they came to you when you were in your junior year?

NEAL: Mm-hm.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And what do you recall of that meeting with the recruiters?

NEAL: Lots of information, lots of questions. In hindsight thinking, gosh, this 00:04:00doesn't sound that bad. But then, you know, figuring out later that he probably sugarcoated things a little bit. But really, it was all about the college money. The fact that I wouldn't have to pay for any schooling was huge. So, yeah, so I turned seventeen that coming January and I signed the papers in February.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And so, you were seventeen when you signed the papers?

NEAL: Mm-hm. And because I was not a legal adult, both of my parents also had to sign. And that program was called Split Op. So, I would go to basic training between my junior and senior year of high school, go back for my senior year, graduate high school, and then leave after graduation to go to AIT for my advanced individual training where I would learn my MOS, my military occupation.

BOWERS HEALEY: And where did you do your basic training between your junior and 00:05:00senior year?

NEAL: Fort Jackson, South Carolina.

BOWERS HEALEY: And how long was that?

NEAL: Eight weeks. Probably closer to ten when you add on the week of being there a week or two before getting there, you're kind of going through all the prerequisite stuff and getting your uniforms and that kind of stuff. So, it probably came out to about ten weeks.

BOWERS HEALEY: Were you with other individuals who were also junior-seniors or not?

NEAL: There were a few other females in my platoon that were still in high school, but not many. 72 females, and probably three or four of us were still in high school.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And at the end of that, um, training that summer, were you for sure still obligated to come back the following year?

NEAL: Yes.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And when you graduated from high school, what year was that?

NEAL: 1993.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And then how long before you came-- did you go back on 00:06:00active duty?

NEAL: Probably a week.

BOWERS HEALEY: All right. And where was that active duty?

NEAL: So, then I went to Fort Lee, Virginia, where I learned my MOS. 92-Golf, which is a cook. And I was in Fort Lee, Virginia, for probably I want to say 12 or 14 weeks. And after that, then I left Fort Lee, Virginia, and I went to Fort Sam Houston, Texas, to 91-Mike school, which is hospital food specialist. So, I'm what's called double MOS queued, meaning I have two-- I had to get one MOS before I could go on to the next MOS. There's not many like that in the military where you have to do one and then into the other one.

BOWERS HEALEY: Did you choose food service, or did it choose you?

NEAL: [Laughs] Well, when I took the ASVAB and went down to the MEP station 00:07:00where you do, like, they do your physical and they see if you're physically capable of joining. Then you get to look at all of the MOS options. And one of them-- I wanted physical therapy, but it wasn't available. So, the gentleman there said, "Well, how about we just look at anything medical." And that's when we pulled up hospital food specialist and I mean, nutrition had interested me. So, I was like, I think that would be okay. So, that's how it kind of was chosen for me.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And did your MOS training in '92 and '91, was that consecutive or did you take a break between them?

NEAL: They were consecutive. So, I went straight-- when I graduated at Fort Lee, Virginia, I was put on a plane and flown directly to Fort Sam Houston.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. In all total, how much training were those two pieces of training?

NEAL: And then Fort Sam was probably another three months so probably at least seven months total for the two of them together.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And after you finished your training in Texas, where did you go then?

NEAL: Then I came back home, went back into Reserve status, just doing Reserve one weekend a month, you know, annual trainings, that kind of stuff. And then I also enrolled in school.

BOWERS HEALEY: Where did you do your one week of training or one weekend of training a month?

NEAL: I belong to the 452nd Combat Support Hospital, which is at 52nd and Silver Spring on the north side of Milwaukee. So that's where I would go to drill once a month and then three times out of the year you would have to go to Fort McCoy to either qualify in M-16s or do any other sort of training. And then one week out of the one period out of the year, they always say it's one week, it's 00:09:00usually more than one week. I bet you I spent at least two weeks on average every year for annual training, and that would be anywhere from Fort McCoy to Fort Gordon, Georgia, Camp Parks, California, Fort Polk, Louisiana, Fort Sheridan, Illinois. All kind of all over the place. But that was annual training.

BOWERS HEALEY: When you signed up, for what period of time did you sign up?

NEAL: I initially enlisted for six active, two inactive. So, eight total. And when I hit the end of my first contract, I extended. So, when I hit that six years, rather than committing for another six, I just extended through the last two and made eight. And then I got really close to ten and I decided, well, I'm either going to get out now or I'm going to stay for the whole 20. You know, if 00:10:00you can make it halfway through, why not go all the way through? So, that's what I decided. When I get around my ten-year mark that I was going to stay in for the full 20.

BOWERS HEALEY: So, when you went on active duty during your Reserve time, did you actually perform cook duties or not?

NEAL: Mm-hm.

BOWERS HEALEY: You did.

NEAL: So, the regular drill weekend where, you know, soldiers would show up Saturday, go home, show up Sunday, go home. On those weekends we, as the kitchen, made lunch just for the soldiers. So, that was our duty for the weekend. Now, when we would go away to just like, a long weekend up in Fort McCoy, our duty was still also just to feed the soldiers. But now it wasn't just lunch, it was generally a hot breakfast, an MRE lunch, which is the meal ready-to-eat, the food in a package. They would get that to take with them as they walk through breakfast, and then they would come back in the evening, and we would have a hot dinner for them. So, that was our role on our-- they call 00:11:00those [inaudible], the extended weekends that we were up in Fort McCoy for like, a Friday, Saturday, Sunday or a Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. That was our role, was to cook for the soldiers. Now, when we went away for like, an annual training, we're a combat support hospital. So, our mission was to set up, role play, and tear down an 84-bed mobile hospital. So, if you think about MASH, like the TV show MASH, right? There was a hospital of tents set up pretty close to the line of war wherever that line of fire was. So, the forward surgical team is the team that's going to be out walking around in the midst of that combat with those other soldiers. Next, you're going to come to a MASH. After MASH, you're going to go to a CSH, which is the Combat Support Hospital. And after the combat support hospital, you would go to what they call a general hospital, which would 00:12:00be like a brick-and-mortar hospital. So, our role was to take the people that had already been kind of triaged through a MASH, bring them to the CSH, and then have to keep them there until they were able to report back to duty or maintain and stabilize them that then they could be shipped off to more of a general hospital, a brick and mortar, because they probably would not be coming back. So, in that role, at a combat support hospital, our role was also to cook for the soldiers, but also to cook for all the patients. So, that's where our hospital food service training came in line, where we would do modified diets, whether it be for a diabetic or someone that maybe now as a newfound hypertension or someone that maybe had some sort of facial injury that now they can't chew properly. So, we're physically modifying the food for them, whether 00:13:00it be chopped or pureed. So, that's where that training came into play. We didn't get to do that role of our MOS very frequently, but that's also the path that I went on the civilian side. So, when I became the NCYC of the kitchens that I ran, I focused a lot of our training on that kind of stuff as well.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Let me take you back a little bit. You've explained that very well. In your pre-interview, you indicated that you met your husband while you were in the Army. When did that occur and where?

NEAL: I met Greg at Fort Sam Houston, Texas. I was there again for 91 Mike school, the hospital food specialist school. He was there for-- I don't remember the acronym, but it was for nursing school. And he had just finished the class that he was in. So, he was in what they call a holdover status. And I had gotten to Fort Sam Houston before my class was ready. So, I was also placed in the 00:14:00holdover status so yeah, we met and, you know, just started dating then and or-- well, not really. I mean, we were talking and getting to know each other, that kind of stuff. But then that was probably September and I graduated from there in November. I came home back here to Oak Creek, and he went from Fort Sam to Fort Gordon, Georgia. That's where he got transferred to.

BOWERS HEALEY: Was he a reservist or in active duty?

NEAL: He was active duty.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: So, at that point, he actually came up to Wisconsin that Christmas. And from that point forward, we were together. So, long distance dating for three years. He in Fort Gordon, me up here, and yeah.

BOWERS HEALEY: Did he have a nursing degree when you met him?

NEAL: No, he didn't. He was a combat medic. He never finished the nursing thing. 00:15:00He stuck with his combat medic.

BOWERS HEALEY: And where was he from originally?

NEAL: Phoenix.

BOWERS HEALEY: Phoenix. Okay.

NEAL: Born and raised in Phoenix. Also lived in California for a little while with his father in San Diego. But then, yeah, when he joined, kind of bounced all over from Korea, Washington, Fort Sam in Texas. I can't think of the name. It's in Tennessee.

BOWERS HEALEY: So, kind of explain. You mentioned that you started school after your Reserve time and yet you married a husband who was active duty. I don't know when that occurred, but how did you work out your career?

NEAL: We got engaged. So, anyway, yeah, I was here going to school. He was done doing active-duty Army, Fort Gordon. And then the Army had a surplus of soldiers at the time. So, you know, Enduring Freedom hadn't happened yet. Desert Storm 00:16:00was over. So, he was offered an early out, an early retirement. Now, it's not technically a retirement. He was just offered an early out, kind of like he could break his contract. And I was here, and the plan was I was just going to-- we were going to get married and I would follow him wherever he would go active duty. Well, when they gave him that opportunity, he decided to take it. So, we got engaged August 4th of 1995. I was down in Fort Gordon visiting, and then I came home and started planning a wedding. And we got married August 3rd of 1996, and he moved here about three weeks before our wedding. I had gotten us an apartment, got it all furnished, and then he moved up here. He started living in the apartment and I stayed with my parents until we got married.

BOWERS HEALEY: And what were you-- you were in school. So, where were you in 00:17:00school and what was your topic?

NEAL: I just finished. So, I graduated like, a month before we got married. Two months before we got married. I went to MATC. I have a degree in dietetic technician. Registered dietetic technician. So, yeah, he came up, we got married. I found a job shortly thereafter, and then he went to school, and he went to MATC as well for a degree in computer technology.

BOWERS HEALEY: MATC stands for what?

NEAL: Milwaukee Area Technical College.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: So, he went there as well. So, I was working, he was going to school, he was working a couple of part time jobs and yeah. Then he finished school, started working for AT&T and he has been with AT&T for 22 years.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: Yeah. So, then he-- when he got off of active duty, also joined the 00:18:00Reserves and he and I were in the same unit at the 452. So, he did ten years of active duty, twelve years of Reserve, and I've done all of my 22 years Reserve.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And you mentioned that you did med readiness on a couple of occasions. When did you do those and where?

NEAL: Let's see. I went to Guyana in 1994 and actually I had-- I kept a journal while I was there, and I read through it this morning just to give me a little refresher. It was a long time ago. So, both missions, both the one to Guyana and the one to Ecuador were very, very similar. It was a group of about 30 soldiers. I was the only cook. Then we had a veterinarian, multiple nurses, three physicians, two dentists, some pharmacy techs. I think that might have been it. 00:19:00And our whole mission was to go down there, and we always stayed in the host's military compound, for lack of a better term. So, when we went to Guyana, we were staying with the Guyanese soldiers on a Guyanese military base post.

BOWERS HEALEY: Can you explain where Guyana is located?

NEAL: The northern end of South America.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: Yeah. We landed in Jamestown, and I know everybody knows about Jamestown with the Kool Aid, right?

BOWERS HEALEY: Right. Okay.

NEAL: And it was a very-- it was a very eye-opening experience for me as a soldier, because I had never been to something so desolate, never to a third world country like that before. So, it made me appreciate a lot of the resources 00:20:00and things that we have here that aren't available other places. I mean, we really are the richest country on Earth in more than one way. So, we flew to Jamestown, landed in Jamestown, stayed there for two nights, and then got on a boat and followed this river down. Because in Jamestown itself, as the city was, I mean, was actually pretty nice. The hotel was pretty nice. That was all fine. But when we got on to the boat and took the river down and went to these very less fortunate areas, that's when you really get to see how people are really living. So, we set up in the Guyanese camp. I had a-- we had a barracks, which was just this long room of cots, but they weren't even a full wall. Like, the walls only went up about seven feet. And then there was like, stilts with a 00:21:00corrugated aluminum roof. So, we were constantly open to the outside and to the air. You were never really in a building. And at the end of that barracks was a small room and that's where I set up my kitchen.

BOWERS HEALEY: Was there running water?

NEAL: No. No running water.

BOWERS HEALEY: Latrines?

NEAL: There was bathrooms. Latrines. But it was like, three toilets that did not flush and did not have toilet seats. So, there was a large cistern that sat on top of the barracks that when it would rain, the cistern would fill with water. And if the system was full, then yes, you'd have water to take a shower or flush the toilet. But if there was no rain and there was no water in the system, then there just wasn't water.

BOWERS HEALEY: What was the temperature like when you were there?

NEAL: It was hot. It was very hot. Yeah. Nights were much cooler, obviously more 00:22:00tolerable, but the daytimes were quite hot. So, in that end area there, I set up everything and all I basically had to-- I served what are called UGRs, which is unit group rations, and each box serves 25 people. So, it's all shelf stable. They did ship, bring, water in those, you know, the large waters that you see put in like, a water dispenser at an office. They would bring large containers of that kind of water in because they knew that we as the US people couldn't consume the water that they were consuming.

BOWERS HEALEY: As part of your job as a cook, do you do the planning or does someone else do the planning to make sure that you have enough UGRs or and other food?

NEAL: So, there was a governing body over our mission. And that governing body 00:23:00made sure that we had everything we needed. So, no, I had no idea what I was going to be serving, how I was going to be serving it. I didn't know what kind of equipment they were going to send. I knew nothing. So, I walked in very blindly and all I got was a Coleman stove, which is something the military doesn't even use. Like what you and I would use to go camping, like a Coleman stove camper, camping stove. A square head, which is what we call in the military a square head. It's basically like, a big baking and roasting pan. It's probably, you know, 18 inches wide, 12 inches tall and, you know, six or seven inches [inaudible].

BOWERS HEALEY: So, you had electricity or not?

NEAL: No electricity. No. No. So, this Coleman stove ran on those little propane tanks. And so, every morning, that's what I would fill the square head and get it boiling. And then in the UGRs, all the food is in what they call like, a tray pack. So, it's a kind of like if you think of kind of like frozen dinners, you 00:24:00know, it's a tray pack about this big, about this deep. And in there serves 25 people, the meat. And then another one is 25 people, their starch, and another one is 25 people, their vegetables. So, I would throw those into the water boiling, get those heated up and then serve. So, every morning I was serving breakfast and dinner to the entire group, so I had to get up about 2 a.m., get things going, get water going, make coffee. I did have a generator so that I could make coffee because coffee was obviously very, very important. So, they made sure, I don't know how, but either the first sergeant or whoever was there decided it was very important for us to have coffee and found us a generator.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: So, I would make coffee, make all of breakfast and feed everybody, and then they would leave, get on the ship or in Humvees, depending on where they 00:25:00were going, and go out to a remote village and take care of those people there.

BOWERS HEALEY: And you didn't do that.

NEAL: I got to go along a couple of times.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: But most often, no, I would stay back, clean up, take a nap. I would do everybody's laundry. I kind of felt like the housewife. [Laughs] I would do everybody's laundry, and then I would start preparing for them to come back for dinner. So, then by the time they pulled back in, I would have their hot dinner ready for them and I would feed them dinner and then clean up and be done.

BOWERS HEALEY: What do the soldiers have for lunch?

NEAL: An MRE. A meal ready-to-eat. Yeah. Yeah. So, they would grab that with them on their way out in the morning and have that while they were gone.

BOWERS HEALEY: And how long were you in Guyana?

NEAL: Two and a half weeks.

BOWERS HEALEY: How did you find the country of Guyana? You've talked about it a little. How was your interaction with the people that were there?

NEAL: Amazing. Amazing. So, kind. So happy to see us. So grateful. The couple of times that I did get to go out with my fellow soldiers to these places to do things, there would be lines of hundreds of people waiting in line to come walk into this clinic that we had set up for anything. From deworming medication to a sore tooth that they wanted pulled to a well-baby check for a new infant. And these people were lined up in their Sunday best just dressed to the tee and so gracious and happy to see us there, to be helping them. I would go with the vet on occasion. There would be a litter of puppies, or someone would own a goat or a cow, and we would-- I would just help him check out the animal, if it needed 00:27:00deworming or maybe a flea bath or something like that. I would help the vet with those kinds of things. I actually got to pull teeth, too. I was very good friends with the--

BOWERS HEALEY: From people or--?

NEAL: Uh-huh. With one of the dentists that was there, and he would let me-- he'd get all prepped up and he's like, "Okay, this tooth has got to go," you know? And he would let me pull the tooth. And it was just a great experience.

BOWERS HEALEY: Is this the MEDRETE, two and a half weeks that you spent in Guyana? Does your whole unit go? Did you volunteer?

NEAL: I volunteered.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: I volunteered. And no, the whole unit did not go. So, it was kind of based on they needed these many docs and these many dentists and, you know, so that list came down from higher up. And then our command would make it known. We have this opportunity for a mission. These are the people that-- these are the MOS' that we need. If you're interested, let us know. And I always signed up. Always.

BOWERS HEALEY: And you did this MEDRETE when you were fairly young early on?

NEAL: Yeah, I was in '94, so yeah. Yeah, I was-- [inaudible].

BOWERS HEALEY: And when did you go to Ecuador?

NEAL: And then Ecuador was in 2007. That was May of 2007.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Tell me a little bit about that experience.

NEAL: Very, very similar. Older, wiser. Had my kids by then, but very, very similar. Exact same concepts. Still going out, still taking care of natives. I was still the only cook there taking-- the conditions were a little bit better. I had an actual kitchen. Now, nothing to what we would call a commercial kitchen in the United States, but very much so more of a commercial kitchen that was easier to prepare and serve and store. They actually had-- you know when you 00:29:00into a gas station, you see a cooler that's got like Coca-Cola at the top and it's just a glass, you know, refrigerated cooler that you can put sodas and stuff. And that was the only source of refrigeration I had. That was the only source of refrigeration anybody on the whole post had.

BOWERS HEALEY: Where did you fly into when you went to Ecuador?

NEAL: Um, I don't remember.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: I don't remember. Mm-mm. I mean, I know there was a lot of hops. Like, even with getting down to Guyana, there was like, Milwaukee to St. Louis to Miami to like, yeah, lots of hops.

BOWERS HEALEY: Were you high in the mountains or were you close to the-- well, where were you in Ecuador, if you know?

NEAL: We were definitely in the jungle more so than anywhere else. We didn't even make it out to the coast. I know we had talked about taking-- well, we made it out to the coast at one point, but it was such a quick like, and only a few 00:30:00people got into a Humvee, drove out there, got to see the ocean, and then we pretty much had to turn around, come back. There wasn't much time for sightseeing as there was as when we were in Guyana. Guyana, we spent two nights at the beginning and the end in the actual city, and that was able to see much more and do much more.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And about how much time did you spend in Ecuador?

NEAL: Three weeks.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And describe the people there.

NEAL: Same. So pleasant, so nice. I made multiple friends with the Ecuadorian soldiers that were there. They had gone out one day and shot a deer, brought it back, prepared it. Um, there is the cook, what they call their cookie, the Ecuadorian. And she was a civilian. She wasn't a military person, but she did all of the cooking for those Ecuadorian soldiers. She would go out to the market 00:31:00every day and come back with just bushels of fresh vegetables and herbs and crabs. I mean, once she dumped this huge bushel of just fresh crabs still crawling around, you know, and she would cook that up and make meals for them. And [laughs] right over here, opening cans. [Laughs]

BOWERS HEALEY: I was just about to ask if the American soldiers ate any of that.

NEAL: They did.

BOWERS HEALEY: They did?

NEAL: They did. I mean, we definitely shared and, you know, tried to make mealtime, you know, the two groups together, you know, sharing meals and experiences and talking.

BOWERS HEALEY: How about the language differences?

NEAL: Well, they spoke pretty good English. So, we did pretty well.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: Yeah, I mean, it's very much expected for that to be their second language, so they did pretty well.

BOWERS HEALEY: During your Reserve time, any other deployments that you made?

NEAL: Just Enduring Freedom. So, Operation Enduring Freedom, that was in, uh, that was 90-- 2003. February of 2003. So, Greg and I were married and had kids-- well, had our daughter by then. So, when we got our orders in February of 2003 that we would be going to active duty for a year, it was a lot to swallow. So, we were living here. We turned off the utilities. I covered all the furniture. Um, we had to make out wills for each of us. We had to have a care plan. And a care plan is when you have two dual military couple, what's going to happen to your children. So, we gave all legal custody to my parents of our daughter. She 00:33:00was two at the time and she moved in with them. And then when we left, I think it was like, the 27th of February, went up to Fort McCoy. We were supposed to be in Fort McCoy for like, six weeks. Just receiving all of our equipment, inventorying it, battle packing it, and then sending it overseas to where we were going to be stationed. All of that happened, took a lot longer than six weeks, though. But then as soon as our equipment made it over, it was shipped over to Turkey to sit on the Turkey-Iraqi border. As soon as it made it over there, the mission dissolved. So, then that freight was turned around and shipped back to the United States. Then our unit of approximately 300 people was 00:34:00cut into basically thirds. One third went home. I was in that third. One third went to Afghanistan to take place of a combat support hospital that was already set up, just take over for that unit. And then the other third, which Greg was in, went to the Sierra Depot, which is in Nevada. So, all of that equipment that came back to the East Coast was then railed from the East Coast all the way down to Nevada. And Greg and his group down in Nevada then had to unpack inventory and turn in all of that equipment to the Sierra Depot.

BOWERS HEALEY: Were you actually-- did you actually get to Iraq and--.

NEAL: No.

BOWERS HEALEY: Never went overseas?

NEAL: No, never went.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And your husband didn't get overseas either.

NEAL: He was over for Desert Storm in the 90s, but he did not go over for Operation Enduring Freedom.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Just mission dissolved and--

NEAL: Mission dissolved, yeah. The rumor that I had heard is that Turkey wanted 00:35:00an astronomical amount of money from the United States to sit on the Turkey-Iraqi border, and the United States wouldn't pay it. So, there went our mission. So then instead, that group of people went to Afghanistan to, you know, work on the war there instead of sitting on that Iraqi border.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Any other-- well, go ahead.

NEAL: Well, at that time also, of being up in Fort McCoy and being ready to go for OEF, I found out I was pregnant. So, that was the reason why I was in that third that went home.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: So, I came home. That would have been around June of 2003. And then Greg went to the Sierra Depot. And then our daughter was born in November, and he was home like, two weeks before she came.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And when during this time period did you re-enlist?

NEAL: I don't even remember.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: [Laughs] I don't even remember. I just remember deciding, like I said, when I hit near that ten-year mark that I was like, okay, you know, so if and when my contract came due, I just-- I didn't even think about it. I just went and signed new one, did my [inaudible] and kept going.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: I was shooting for the 20.

BOWERS HEALEY: In addition to doing your weekend drills and summertime drills, was there anything else that you needed to do to keep being able to re-enlist?

NEAL: Yeah. So, I had to continue getting rank. So, E-1 to E-4, enlisted one to enlisted four, pretty much comes automatically with just time in but once you hit E-4, specialist, if you want to be in any longer, you're going to have to 00:37:00work your way through the ranks and get your rank. Otherwise, they're probably going to put you out. They don't want a 45-year-old specialist sitting around. They want you to work through your ranks and get your, get your rank. So, I went to PLDC so I could get my E-5.

BOWERS HEALEY: What is that?

NEAL: Primary and leadership and development course, which is the course that you need to take in order to get promoted to E-5.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. And where did you-- I'm sorry, where did you do that?

NEAL: That was also Fort McCoy.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: And there's a, there's a, there's a pre-story to that. So, there was a point in time where the Army would be like, okay, if you're going to go to PLDC and get your E-5, we'll give you a rank now. Pending that you go and get that schooling done within 12 months. Well, that happened to me right before I got pregnant with my first daughter, Jasmine. I got my E-5. So, then I go through the whole pregnancy, I have her, and it's time for me to go to PLDC within that 00:38:0012-month window so I don't lose my E-5 and I was still nursing Jasmine and the school would not accommodate me to pump at school. So, I turned it down and then I lost my rank. So, I went back to E-4. And then turned around and did everything and got my E-5, went to PLDC, and got that done.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: The military has changed a lot in the past three or four years as far as accommodating female mothers in the military. It was very, very hard to be a reservist and be pregnant and or nursing when I was in. So, for six straight 00:39:00years, I had a baby in nursing. Had a baby, nursing, had a baby, nursing. And those six years were extremely testing and difficult. Um, I remember climbing on the back of a five ton up in Fort McCoy to do range training and I was eight months pregnant. And how I was expected to do everything everybody else did, regardless of how far along I was.

BOWERS HEALEY: What year was that?

NEAL: That would have been-- She was [inaudible], that would been 2001.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: Pumping. Thankfully, one of the actual officers from my unit now, she has made it so that there is now a special t-shirt that a nursing mother can wear 00:40:00underneath her uniform that accommodates her to then be able to pump while still keeping that t-shirt on and still being able to pump and put her milk away. That wasn't the case when I was doing it. It was looked down upon. Um, we weren't given the privacy or the location to do such a thing. So, it made getting rank and getting through those things more difficult for me. But I wasn't about to not do it. And my head was-- my mind was made up and I was going to do it. So, I did.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: So, that was PLDC. Then I also went to BNCOC, which is basic noncommissioned officer school. That is the school to get E-6. And when you-- once you get through PLDC, BNCOC and ANCOC, which is basic officer noncommissioned school and advanced noncommissioned officer school, those two 00:41:00schools have one week that is more general educating and then the other week is more specific to your MOS, your military occupation. So, I did BNCOC then I went to Fort Sam Houston, Texas, where I had more schooling on how to be a noncommissioned officer in our field of study, came home, got my E-6, and then a year later, or maybe two years later, it might have been two, went to ANOCC, advanced noncommissioned officer school, so I could get my E-7. The day I was awarded my E-7 was also the day that I was awarded my 20-year letter. And if you retire, when you retire, you have to-- the retirement pay that you're going to get is going to be the highest rank that you held for a minimum of two years. 00:42:00So, had I gotten out right away at that 20-year mark, even though I had just gotten my E-7, I would have been paid in retirement pay as an E-6. So, that's why I stayed two more years. I stayed two more years as an E-7 so that when my retirement check does come, I will get paid as an E-7 and not an E-6.

BOWERS HEALEY: And as a reservist, when does your retirement start?

NEAL: At the age of 60 is when your check starts.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: You reap all of the other benefits between their-- [Bowers Healey coughing]

BOWERS HEALEY: Excuse me.

NEAL: Getting to go to the VA and PX, you hold all of the other benefits. But the retirement check doesn't start until 60. So, I was 39 when I retired. So, I got a ways to go.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Alright. So, you decided to get out at 22?

NEAL: Mm-hm.

BOWERS HEALEY: Could you have stayed in longer?

NEAL: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. But it was, it was becoming a toll. I was working full time as a food service sales rep, traveling all over the state of Wisconsin, the UP, northern Illinois. And then at that point in time, having the rank that I had, I was also running the kitchen. So, I had a lot on my plate. So, what was should have been just a Reserve gig of one week in a month was more like 10 to 15 hours a week of things that I would have to do from writing NCOERs, which are like an annual review that you would do for your employees. So, this was an annual thing that I had to do for all the NCOs that were underneath me, to ordering food, to being there the day before drill started to get the food as it was delivered, to keeping track of receipts. But it was just a lot of responsibility. The higher rank you are, the more responsibility you 00:44:00have. I had an issue with a soldier that got pulled over speeding. He was a-- he was a bit of a troublesome soldier. He had some issues in his personal life and he got pulled over and he had a loaded .45 in his glove box. So, he chose to have the officers call me. Not his parents, not his siblings, not-- me. So, again, a lot of responsibility was falling in my lap. And the more rank I would have had, the more that would have increased. And it was taking time away from my family and my personal life, even my job. So, I decided 22 was enough. And I do not regret one single minute of what I did or one single minute of when I stopped. I did my 22 years. I felt like I contributed a lot. I learned a lot, 00:45:00and I felt good about passing the torch.

BOWERS HEALEY: And you mentioned you did go to school. Were you able to use G.I. benefits for that?

NEAL: Mm-hm. Well, I got my degree in dietetic technology, and I did not pay one penny. Not for a book, not for school, not for parking, not one penny. And they paid me a small amount of money every month, you know, for living expenses. So, yeah, that's another reason why I stayed in. Another-- you don't under-- I didn't understand it when I joined and they said, "Oh, well, you'll get--" whatever it was, like $12,000 worth of college money or whatever it was. What I didn't understand is when you go to school, you have to take out the loans in your own name. And then as long as you stay in the Reserves every year, they make a payment on that loan for you. But the moment you get out, if there is any 00:46:00outstanding loan, it's your responsibility. So, of course, they paid the minimum. They didn't pay much. So, when I hit that ten-year mark and I saw how much money was still left on my loans, I said, well, I'm not-- I'm not going to pay that. So, I-- I stayed in and they paid for all of it.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Tell me about, going to I'm Not Invisible, what was that all about? Where was it? When did you do that?

NEAL: So, I Am Not Invisible, it came across in an e-mail and I get all the e-mails from the veteran museum in Madison. I signed up for a few of those. And so, I constantly am getting-- and I always read through them all and they had this I Am Not Invisible, looking for, you know, female veterans. And I was like, 00:47:00okay. I can, you know, so I looked into it, and they said, "Yeah, come on down." Well, then I come down and, you know, all of its kind of intertwined. I have a very good-- we went to the Healing Warrior Hearts, my husband and I, event a couple of years ago. Met some friends, now some of those friends are through the UW-Milwaukee system, which was where the shoot was. I mean, it's just a small world, right? Everywhere you go, you're running into somebody you know. So, I signed up. They said come down. Went down, wore my uniform. I did the photo shoot. Couple of weeks later, it popped up on Facebook through the I'm Not Invisible Facebook page. Yeah, I'd met with Luke, Luke did that short little interview with me. Yeah. It's really nice because it's-- I never thought about it so much as I have in the past couple of years that being a female vet, not that people don't appreciate it or recognize it, it's just not assumed that 00:48:00females are veterans and not by anybody's ill will or poor thinking. It's just like, when I walk into the VA now, I just was in the VA last week for a procedure. I walked in with my husband and although we are both vets, we were there for my appointment and at the desk the gentleman looked at me and said, "Oh, are you the visitor?" And I said, "No, he's the visitor." And the gentleman looked at me and said, "You're the vet?" "Yes, yes, I'm the vet. And he's the--"

BOWERS HEALEY: And that was at the veteran's hospital?

NEAL: Mm-hm.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: Here in Milwaukee. Again, not by anybody's ill will. It's not trying to, you know, it's just an assumption, right? That people make, that women are not necessarily vets. So, it's nice to see that these programs, these things are 00:49:00coming into play. I can't wait to see when the pictures actually come somewhere that you can go see them. I just think it's great that the women are being recognized.

BOWERS HEALEY: And you may have said, but where did you actually go for the I'm Not Invisible?

NEAL: It was at UW-Milwaukee. The college campus. One of the buildings there, I don't remember which one it was, but yeah. They had set up photo shoot in an area and, you know, just then like the-- the interviewing in another area and yeah, just great.

BOWERS HEALEY: Well, good. Yeah. Have you been active in any other military organizations since your retirement?

NEAL: Um, no. No. I think-- I shouldn't say I think. At some point in time, my husband and I do plan on being more active. It's just really difficult right now with a full-time job and kids and everything else.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: But yeah, I mean, we try to stay in the background.

BOWERS HEALEY: Have you ever been asked to speak at a school or an organization?

NEAL: Oh, yeah. Yeah. And I have. Yeah. I've spoke at my children's school twice. Um, I did a presentation, actually, for my employer. Um, gosh, it was a long time ago. Yeah. I mean, you know, we try to like-- we try to stay active with, like, Healing Warrior Hearts and other things.

BOWERS HEALEY: What is Human Warrior Hearts?

NEAL: Healing Warrior Hearts is another nonprofit organization that puts on retreats and each retreat, although trying to accomplish the same thing, is geared toward either an all-female retreat, an all-male retreat, a couples retreat, an LGBTQ retreat. So, each retreat is geared toward that group. But then the overall underlying mission of the retreat is the same. To help people work through maybe it's a PTSD, maybe it's a specific trauma. Things like that 00:51:00may have happened in life, and it's a safe space for all of those people to share and discuss and learn tools and ways to work through some of those negative things that may have happened.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. You have a few things for show and tell. Do you want to do that?

NEAL: Sure. Sure.

BOWERS HEALEY: You can kind of bring them in front of you.

NEAL: Sure. So, this is the flag I received when I retired. So, just a flag in a case.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: And then this shadow box is all of the coins that I have received over my career.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay, turn that a little so the light doesn't hit it so much. That's better.

NEAL: Right there?

BOWERS HEALEY: That's better. Okay.

NEAL: Or I could-- You want me to just bring it back?

BOWERS HEALEY: No, you're picking up more light now. I see it's just hard when you've got something like that. So, okay. I think we saw that.

NEAL: So, that's-- yup, the coins that I've received from multiple different 00:52:00things. This is-- this is my basic training photo.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay. Good.

NEAL: As my little 17-year-old self. And we didn't talk too much about-- there's another thing that I did. It's called the Connelly. I think maybe we'll touch on that later, but I've got some stuff from the Connelly that I'd like to show you.

BOWERS HEALEY: All right. Why don't you-- while you're showing, tell me about the Connelly. I don't know what the Connelly is.

NEAL: Well, this is the certificate of appreciation I received from the 801st, which is another thing that we haven't gotten into. When I got my 20-year letter and I was at the 452nd Combat Support Hospital and my E-7, I was then transferred from the 452 to the 801st, which is in Fort Sheridan, Illinois. Also, a combat support hospital. And there I was the NCYC of the dining services there. And then this is my Army Commendation Medal also from the 801st.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: So, while in the 452nd, there is something called the Philip A. Connelly program. And I'm going to just read a little bit about it. So, Philip A. Connelly was born in Framingham, Massachusetts in June 1907. Philip A. Connelly became a leader in his chosen profession, the food service management. He worked diligently and earnestly throughout his life to promote professionalism in food service in both civilian industry and military services. As a result of his dedicated purpose and positive influence, civilian and military food service programs are more closely aligned and personnel in these programs now have uniform goals in education, training, career development and job opportunities. So, the Philip A. Connelly program is aligned with the National Restaurant Association and the Department of the Army, deputy chief of staff, The Joint Culinary Center of Excellence Special Programs administers the program, the NRA 00:54:00participates in the evaluation of finalists and the presentation of awards and offer culinary training opportunities as a recognition. So, the objectives are to improve the professionalism of food service personnel, thus providing the best quality food service to support diners, provide recognition for excellence in the preparation and observing of food and army dining facilities and field kitchen operations. And that's where we come into play, the field. Provide incentives to competitive programs by adding a higher level of competition and recognition, Award individuals for stellar management practices, promote and improve Army food service by providing competition, incentives, professional training and media coverage, provide measurable results directly impacting readiness and go to war skills and train culinary professionals to provide nutritional meals. So, this was brought to me in 2009. Do you guys want to do the Connelly? And I had no idea what this was, what it was all about. I did a 00:55:00little research and at that point I was the NCYC of the 452nd Combat Support Hospital kitchen. When I came to the 452, it was being run by Master Sergeant Don Toohey and the OIC, which was Colonel St John. Fantastic people, were there for a long, long time. And then we all also had a higher NCO that would like, run the day-to-day events in the kitchen. Well, after Enduring Freedom and coming home, all of those people left and I was it. So, I was forced to figure out and run the kitchen and then also get myself through all that schooling so that I could carry the rank that would come along with it. So, I decided that, yeah, we should do this. It would be a good way to kind of turn the tide around, make us recognized again for doing what we do. So, we did the Connelly and we 00:56:00won. We won. So, here is the award from the 452nd Combat Support Hospital, winner of the 807th Connelly Award for Food Service Excellence. [inaudible]

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: That was a huge undertaking. A huge accomplishment. Endless, endless hours of preparation on my personal time, not just at the unit. And then still all the while, still doing our stuff that we needed to do on a regular drill weekend, preparing lunch or going to Fort McCoy and shooting our M-16s, whatever it was. This was above and beyond that. And then we did it again in 2011, and we did not win, but we were runner up. So, that is something I'm very, very proud of. And this was-- a friend of mine was at his unit and this was in the dumpster and they were going to throw it away and he pulled it out and brought it home to me. So, this is half of the-- there was two pieces. I don't know what happened to the other one, but this was what was posted outside of the kitchen when we did 00:57:00our Connelly competition. And this just touches on half of the people that were there. So, there I am as the NCYC.

BOWERS HEALEY: And point to which picture you are? Up there. Okay. Can you tilt that just a little bit, so the sun doesn't pick it up quite as much? Well, okay. Got it.

NEAL: How about that?

BOWERS HEALEY: Pretty good. We're getting some of it. Yeah. Okay. Great.

NEAL: So, yeah. So, that was the Connelly. And it's one of those things that unless you're in the industry, unless you know what it all entails, unless you know something about food service, you know, it doesn't mean-- it doesn't mean much. But to people that are in it, they get it. And that was a very, very proud moment for myself and my soldiers.

BOWERS HEALEY: Great. So, anything else we haven't touched on that you'd like to talk about?

NEAL: Um, we talked-- I talked briefly about when I hit my 20 years and got my E-7, I also needed to do two more years, but I couldn't do it at the 452 because of my rank. That slot was being held, so I had to move. So, they transferred me to the 801st. And what was interesting about the 801st, again, exact same unit. It's another combat support hospital, but their cooks were not cooking. They had a kitchen, but it wasn't functional and they didn't have any cooks that were high enough ranking that knew how to turn the kitchen around. So, that unit would go out every drill weekend for lunch and eat on the economy. On the Army's dollar. So, they would, you know, send them all to Jimmy John's and pay for it, 00:59:00or they would send them all to a buffet and pay for it. So, when I got there and I sat down with the commander and the first sergeant, I said I want to change that. I want to bring cooking back to this unit and I want to get these people that you have here that are coming here every drill weekend and doing nothing, I want them cooking again. And that's what I did.

BOWERS HEALEY: And where is the 801st located?

NEAL: Fort Sheridan, Illinois.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay.

NEAL: Northern-- not too far from what people-- Great America.

BOWERS HEALEY: So, that was more of a drive for you to get there?

NEAL: Oh, yeah. But I would still-- I mean, not horrible. I still would come home at night. I wouldn't spend the night down at Fort Sheridan. I would come home. And yeah, I turned that around and probably-- it probably took me four months to get the kitchen turned around. But then we started cooking and I was teaching those soldiers things that I learned in cook school that they never did. So, I'm not sure if, you know, like, the military's protocol on cook school 01:00:00had changed, you know, from the 20 years prior when I was there, which obviously makes sense.

BOWERS HEALEY: Do you know whether there was a savings for the military or was it more just having cooks do what they're supposed to do?

NEAL: I think actually what happened was that the industry changed where when I was going through cook school, we did everything from scratch as to where when they were coming through cook school, they probably had less soldiers going through that schooling than they did when I was number one. And number two, I think there is far more items that are available to heat and serve now than there was back then. So, I think where we were making cakes and pies, they were just buying frozen cakes, frozen pies, heat and serve. Where we were buying whole raw chickens and having to wash them, cut them up and prepare them, they 01:01:00were just buying chickens that were already cut up and ready to prepare. So, there was just a lot of things that I feel like they probably thought they didn't need to learn because the industry was doing it for them. So, I took us all the way back to basics. We didn't buy anything pre-made. We did everything from scratch. And I taught those cooks how to cut up a chicken into eight piece, how to make your own gravy, how to julienne vegetables or, you know, just all of these different things that they had just lost or never learned because it just wasn't taught to them. So, that was another kind of feather in my hat. I was really proud of getting the 801st back up and running and knowing when I walked in the door, I said I'm only going to be here two years and we're going to get this program back and running and you guys are going to become proud of what you do. And I took two of the highest-ranking people and brought them up to par, got 01:02:00them to school, got them rank and got them trained to do what I did, and then walked away.

BOWERS HEALEY: Retirement.

NEAL: Mm-hm.

BOWERS HEALEY: All right. Very good. Um, anything else you want to add concerning your military career?

NEAL: I don't think so. But now's a good time for me to use the restroom if I can.

BOWERS HEALEY: Okay, we'll do that. I think we probably come to an end anyway. You've already talked about your family and your civilian job, so I think we'll just cut it off at this time. I appreciate your insight on the Reserves in particular.

NEAL: Great, thanks.

BOWERS HEALEY: And food service, also. Thank you.